Jonathan Frid’s Second Visit to the Dick Cavett Show, August 2, 1968

dick cavett

 

This interview was supplied by Dino DiOssi.

Jonathan Frid’s Second Visit to the Dick Cavett Show

August 2, 1968

Guests included: The Association, Abby Lincoln

Dick Cavett: May we have the house lights dimmed. I should like to introduce my next guest now who is best seen in a dim light. It’s hard to think of him as a creature without sunlight. You all know my dear friend Barnabas, don’t you? We’ll see – go man? (Jonathan Frid comes down the center of the aisle out in the audience towards the stage. He is wearing a little flashlight around his neck.)

Jonathan Frid: How’s this for neckwear?

DC: Lovely.

JF: Thank you. May I make myself at home?

DC: Yes you may. I don’t think we can stop him.

Audience: Bite Dick Cavett!

JF: Outside, later.

DC: Bite my neck! Hi Barney .. eh, Jonathan. I think you’ve created a monster. This is Jonathan Frid. I know you don’t want to believe that because you want to think it’s Barnabas. Jonathan, welcome!

JF: Thank you, Dick and before I go any further, may I take out my teeth? Would you mind? There they are …

DC: Would you mind turning your back?

JF: No, I certainly would not. What’s that denture wash that they advertise on television. I think they need it.

DC: We have a little plastic cup. You can drop them in here.

JF: I’ll put them in my pocket.

DC: Welcome, sir!

JF: Thank you, Dick. It’s nice to be back.

DC: Yes, you were here one other time. Oh, I got a nasty letter about you from . .. here’s what it was. You came on in the first half hour of the show, you know, and there was some lady in a section of the country who sees – does not get the first half hour of the show and she took me up one side and down the other for bringing you on then and said, “I waited for him for weeks!”

JF: Oh, it was a nasty letter to you then.

DC: To me, not about you, yes. She’s absolutely waiting for you outside now.

JF: Hmm.

DC: What’s the latest development now in Barnabas’ life? I know you can speak for him.

JF: Well, I know at this point I’m not a vampire, strangely enough.

DC: Get him out!! (audience laughter)

JF: I have been cured but don’t worry because we’ve got two more vampires coming on the show.

DC: It’s only a temporary thing though isn’t it? I mean, the spell is not necessarily, totally . .

JF: Well, you see it all depends on the monster, Adam. As long as he lives, I will be all right. Somehow or other, don’t ask me why or how it happened, but some of my life force is in him and I think this show has more medical quackery than any other soap opera. So anyway, that’s the state I’m in right now and some people say, oh, why aren’t you back as a vampire biting and so forth and personally I’m sort of enjoying this being the nearest thing in my life to being what my family always wanted me to be and that is the kind of guy next door type of actor and I’ve never been that. So now I’m being, well the guy in the next mansion or something.

DC: Your mother didn’t raise you to bite people’s necks?

JF: No.

DC: What is the reaction of close relatives to your persona?

JF: Well, I think they’re glad I’m working and I am too. I’m very happy about that. I say I think that they would have liked me to play something a little bit more close to everyday life, shall we say, but I think as long as an actor is working I think – I’m glad to play anything, and as a matter of fact, I think I’ve said this before. I’ve enjoyed this role because it has had many manifestations. Actually, I’ve spent about 2 or 3 minutes in the year and a half I’ve been on the show – I’ve spent about 2 or 3 minutes actually “biting”. I mean you can’t – that gets a little tedious after a while.

DC: But 2 or 3 minutes of “biting” is more than normal in most people’s cases. You will admit that.

JF: You caught me there!

DC: We have a message and we’ll be back. Stay with us.

(Commercial break)

DC: Jonathan, someone handed me the Grand Rapids Times just before I came on and I didn’t get time to read this but there is a picture of you atop a black limousine, and there’s a crowd, police and there’s a headline . .TV VAMPIRE CAUSES GRAND RAPIDS AIRPORT RIOT. What . . what were you doing?

JF: Well, in this tour that I took about – this is a little while back – and I took a ten city tour in five days while was kind of rough going and . .but the thing about it was that no one really expected a turnout that we would get in all these airports and shopping centers and things like that – so that there was no kind of organized control of crowds. So we got to, well, we had been in Ft. Wayne that afternoon and there was rather an uncontrolled crowd at the supermarket and the supermarket sent a $2,000 bill for injury to shrubbery and things like that to the local station, and we were held up there so we were late getting into Grand Rapids and I would like to apologize – I hope this show goes to Grand Rapids because I would like to make an apology to the people out there. They had this thing arranged at the airport where I was to judge a contest of ghouls and . ..

DC: Pretty ghouls, huh?

JF: This is what you get into when you . ..

DC: A former Shakespearean actor and they’re playing a pretty ghoul is like a melody. Then what happened?

JF: Well, they had a crowd where our plane landed and the thing got out of hand that we all got kind of nervous, including the officer who ran the airport and more or less ordered us off the place. Well, I don’t blame them because everything . . and there was no one to blame up there, it was just that there was so much uncontrolled chaos and so we got this hearse, and, oh yes, the poor chap who was running the whole show was on top of the hearse as we were leaving and we . ..it was ordered down the road into town and there was the poor guy who was running the whole show was way down the countryside when we finally got the hearse to stop and had to walk or run back or whatever about half a mile back to the airport to try to take over control of the thing. But I remember as it turned out we never got to take control of the thing. But I remember as it turned out we never got to this contest around the front of the airport and I’m only very sorry that I was never able to make that. But while we were, while I was getting on top of this hearse myself – I must say I was rather, if you’ll pardon the expression – mortified, and so anyway we were sort of circling around in front of the thousands of teenagers and so forth and a regular commercial airliner was unloading at that point and I . .suddenly I was trying to think of their point of view – here they were with these thousands of kids andthis idiot on top of this hearse with fangs, and what was going on, you know, what’s happened to America? So I pretended to be waving at the crowd and the only reason I did that was because the tape hid me from the people getting off the plane. I didn’t want them to see who it was, so they couldn’t see. I must say it was rather .. it was a fun thing to do in a way, but it was . . I thought that was kind of stretching a point.

DC: Yes, I think an artist has to be treated with more respect. Do you have any fun on the tours, though? Can you meet people?

JF: Oh, yes. As I say, it was pretty hectic. I never got to see any of these tours. All of my life I have wanted to go to Charleston. Well, I did and all I saw was the airport and a supermarket and the station. And I said where’s this beautiful Charleston that I’ve always heard about – well, look over there about five miles and you’ll see a steeple or something. Well, I never really get to see these towns. You just sort of – you’re on display all the time. But it’s you know, I enjoy it.

DC: I can see that it’s really become a problem for you to anywhere as a regular person.

JF: Well, it’s a – oddly enough, it’s a …once you get away from the crowd you – I disappear in my own neighborhood. If you keep walking fast enough and mind your own business, you’re all right, but you can easily get a crowd, you know, if you’re that kind of a person who wants a spectacular riot going around you all of the time, but if you mind your own business, people will leave you alone if you walk fast enough and I think I’m lucky living in Manhattan because I think 90% of the people in Manhattan are working people during the daytime and I don’t think they get a chance to watch the soap operas as much, somehow or other, as people in the outlying cities.

DC: I read in the “TV Guide” article about you that you’re so busy now that you hardly ever have time to get your laundry taken to the Laundromat.

JF: That’s quite true. As a matter of fact, I just picked up some last night which I was sorely in need of but as a matter of fact I went to this laundromat about a week ago and they were in the state of re-doing the whole place. I went to pick it up and they were fixing some blowers or something and some of the soot from the old blowers had gotten all over my laundry so they had to do it all over again, so I’ve been kind of stuck again this week for laundry.

DC: Send this man some laundry. When we come back maybe the audience would like to ask you some questions . .

(Commercial break)

DC: I’m sitting here with Jonathan Frid and my whole left side just went numb. Try not to ask if he opens tomato juice cans with his teeth and things like that. What would you like to know from Jonathan? Yes, sir, gentleman in the cape.

JF: Hello, brother!

DC: I was wondering if you’ve done any research on the vampire legend and if you believe in any of the material about it yourself?

JF: I began to do a certain amount of research. I did, but then I sort of cooled it because we kind of tend to make up our own rules anyway, you know, a little bit and if . . I’ve found in the past that in doing too much research, if the producers haven’t gone along with it and the writers haven’t gone along with it, you just become frustrated. I’ve done that with – I talked about this on another show recently – I was researching Richard III when I was playing it an if you try to research that play which is a sheer exercise in villainy, you’re in big trouble. I mean, if you actually research the historical documents on Richard, he wasn’t all that bad, so you might as well forget it and just take the play for what it is. I think in this case too, I think . . I don’t really believe too much in all of this if I tell the truth, but you know, I play the moment that is given to me by the writers and so forth and so on, and I let it go pretty much at that. I’ve done some research on it, yes. I know a lot more about vampires than I ever did before. I’ll say that much!

DC: Yes, the lady on the aisle.

Lady: Do you enjoy playing a vampire?

JF: Yes, I enjoy playing the role of Barnabas Collins. The vampire part is fine, you know, but it’s – there’s a lot more to it than just vampire. I mean, it’s not a gimmick role really. It’s has an awful lot to play when you take the whole character over the period of a year. There have been many emotions to play, many situations, many problems that are not just biting people.

DC: It would be hard to think of you as anything else for awhile. I can’t see you as Tom Sawyer for a long time. The gentleman on the isle there.

Man: How do you feel about your fans. Do you read all of your fan mail?

JF: Well, I love the fans. They’ve made me what I am. Indeed they really have as far as the story is concerned because – we watch the mail very carefully. The producers watch the mail for that reason to take ideas. They still think about ideas all the time. Our going into the past was strongly influenced by the fact that people wanted to know where I came from.

DC: So the fan mail could influence the plot?

JF: They can influence the plot. But I enjoy the mail. I must say that, you know, when you get a great quantity of mail it’s pretty hard to keep up with it. So again, I want to publically apologize to people who may not have heard from me. It’s because there is so much.

DC: I feel sorry for this gentleman because we can’t get a mike to him – so yell it out and I’ll repeat it.

Man: Grayson Hall is the woman doctor and that kept you going for awhile. Is it Grayson Hall?

JF: She’s still keeping me going!

Man: There always seems to be a great rapport between the two of you when you are acting, at least I feel this way. Is there such a thing?

JF: Yes, oh yes! I’m very fond of Grayson and we kid a lot. We kid around an awful lot, you know, before we do these scenes endlessly together, and so we have a lot of fun together and she’s a ball. She makes working at that studio a party every day. I get all my entertainment at the studio.

DC: You were asking is there anything going on between them, didn’t you? The young lady on the isle.

JF: Now please! Her husband writes the show. I’d better watch myself.

DC: There’s your answer. Yes, yes ma’am, I mean.

Lady: Would you rather play a romantic scene with a beautiful girl?

JF: Yes, I enjoy them very much. But again, I like the variety in the role. I mean, one of the scenes I often play I have a kinney [kinescope?] film of one of the shows of a love scene I was having with Josette with Angelique that I’m very proud of.

DC: Oh, we’re being swept away. We’ll all have to come back.

-End of Interview-

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Picking Up The Pieces…

(((Deep Breath)))

Well, with the final needed commentary of up to five chunky responses per episode (not that I don’t encourage shorter ones else where) and the release of Episode 14: Reunion At The Old House, I’m beginning to finally soothe my wounds. Strangers met in various spots and a trickle of old friendships renewed are showing me the world of thoughtfulness and caring has not entirely come to an end.

I never could believe being an online entertainer would bring so much grief, but it sure has. I see people who are capable in the daily complexities of human life get online and become vegetation when it concerns anything positive. The general hail attitude of “social” networks is really the most depressing thing I’ve witnessed. The facade of showing off enjoyable vacations to people who aren’t allowed to go on one is incredibly detrimental. Moreover it’s gross to see the fading of positive discussion revert to “clicks” and “shares”. What does this leave us? The negative discussion. People won’t stop complaining about the tiniest aspects. And when they complain about entertainment as if it’s out there wielding a sword toward their soul, something that is imbibed by choice, I must wonder if they are aware they have any choice about it.

Still, I came home from my Halloween celebration and realized it was time. My sweetheart didn’t take up too much of the bandwidth in the house and Episode 14 was all ready and waiting to lend itself to ears unknown. Rather quick reaching iTunes too. I had it transferred in almost no time. I was gratefully listening in and fell asleep with it playing. My love affair with Willie Loomis may continue after all. ❤

Of course, the wisdom Wadsworth brings still touches me after all of this time. It’s as if I am Willie Loomis and Wadsworth has made tea for me and explains, “You know you’ve hardly been treated very well and you likely got the idea that such behaviour was both normal and natural.” Wadsworth is right. I even gloried in so many like-clicks once upon a time. That glory was short-lived but I made an acceptance briefly that clicks were just peachy. They never were and they never will be. It’s a way of whittling down the positive to an emptiness so shallow we couldn’t even see what it did to us.

And here I am having become a monster myself. Having a temper about technical aspects, like files not loading right, or a character voice not coming out as well as I would like (Alan Alda’s “Hawkeye” is a major pain!) is one thing. But to be told repeatedly on the aspect of silence and clicks that “this is just the way things are” is anathema to a grieving soul. I feel as if I was shouting the soonest and the loudest and now? Several people have approached me about “social” networks and saying,

“God! This is so stupid!”

“This is empty. I’ve never met any of these people and we never talk to each other.” 

“I can’t believe I spent five hours last night clicking a bunch of worthless crap.”

“I don’t touch that thing. If my brother can’t be bothered to call his own sister or our mother on the telephone then I don’t see much love there at all.”

“Yeah, Facebook. It’s a bunch of s****y people saying a bunch of s*****y things.”

“Why the heck am I staring at still shots of Gomez Addams when I could be watching the man?”

“I can’t take it anymore! I have to get off this thing and SEE SOMEONE!”

“I miss doing all the things that I love like reading, writing, visiting people or viewing my favorite shows and movies.”

“When did I decide that being completely alone in my apartment all of the time without really contacting anyone was how life was meant to be lived?”

“What is the point of a social network when all anyone does is click with nothing added?”

“I feel like my brain died for two years.”

Okay, it’s not just me. However I will venture to say I feel the suffering more than most. When you’re looking for insight and laughs from an entertainment product you never could have dreamed you could create while everyone has gone into a hypnotic realm of only speaking up when there is something negative and only clicking or lurking when there is something they enjoy? Well… you have what I have become: A monster, and the kind of monster Barnabas Collins was ashamed to be. His love for his friends and family is so deeply felt he had little choice but to wallow in some sense of evil, then back-pedal when he acclimated to a new set of loved ones. The depth of his character is beyond remarkable.

Dark Shadows fandom is likely the hardest thing to make a relief series for in this time of technological confusion and disconnect with people. If The Addams Family fans encouragement, and The Ghost & Mrs. Muir’s gentler aspect didn’t exist I’m not sure where on earth I could have ended up. Worse than this? Another victim of suicide? Thankfully, enough people spoke up just when I needed them most and spoke up with fury at the negativity they witnessed, both in their lives and about characters they loved. And they all finally said the same thing, “You don’t deserve this, Daryl. You’re a human being with feelings. Not an entertainment machine.” Bless you, yes. And may I add, “Aren’t we all?”

Perhaps this is another reason why the extremists of Dr. Hoffman pushing the issue with her unrequited love for Barnabas Collins became so severe. Unrequited love feels neglect very strongly. What time in our history would it have been stronger than right now? Many of these people are angry at not getting the attention they need, not feeling heard, even some Angelique extremists are in that same boat. Now would be the time to go ape-s**t on strangers from a sense of losing loved ones to their becoming robots everywhere they look. Why not go crazy on a fictional character and those who adore him for himself?

Plus these people have the most to lose because they managed to sway public opinion about who he loves or should love due to the pile up of story after story previously written. Who would have thought so many fans would ever be able to watch Dark Shadows in its entirety again? But now it’s happening. People see 1795 and mourn Barnabas’ losses. Fans re-watch and re-discover who had what feelings for whom. And they ask, “What was I reading all of that time? I’m not seeing and hearing the same people on this screen.” It must be heart-breaking and confusing as Hell.

(The speculation and insinuation about the actors is even more grotesque. I never, ever wished to bother them. They have their own lives just as we all do. And I can’t contemplate the merest desire of stalking the memory of dead people to sway anyone’s opinion beyond taking what they expressed at face value. Tabloid newspapers and magazine columnists have much to answer for in fixating our minds to this excess merely to make money.)

I recall Walter Koenig expressing that Star Trek was the science-fiction of his life because it had so little bearing on who he was as a person. This is one of the reasons I am so expressive with my own life to make sure no one is getting the wrong idea about me. Short attention spans don’t help this much, but that’s likely the reason Providence put this blog-writing into my perspective. It can be read repeatedly until some blasted humanity finally sinks in with someone and for keeps.

I have been given a plethora of gifts and extraordinary talent in a time when it’s not wanted enough to be appreciated well by those who enjoy it. The focus is to only discuss the negative right now, minus a precious few people out there. When that is the focus and that is the constant exposure the result creates a very impolite demon out of someone. Rather than encourage those who have something better to offer, the general online public prefers to insult and badmouth in great detail anything they even remotely dislike online. It hasn’t just made me “insane”, the constant attitude has made many others just as foul themselves. (My mind is still reeling at so many hateful reviews about “The Time Machine” movie that came out in 2002! Sheesh! Did that hurt anyone other than the poor women playing The Morlocks???)

So here we are in The Pit of Ultimate Dark Shadows. I never knew that title would be so damned fitting! It sure speaks volumes during this dreadful age of online negativity. I’ve had pen pals, on paper, express to me, “Is everyone just socially inept or psychotic?! Dear Heavens! I see name-calling and spiteful words on book reviews or at the people who loved the books!”

But this begs the question: Where are the people who aren’t psychotic nor socially inept?

They exist outside the online world. Some of them only show these tendencies when they “plug-in”. Phone calls and voice chats show me people who are very different from what they type. Extremely different in fact. This was the purpose in making the darn postcards, really. (I still don’t understand why so many people online tried to dissuade me from doing that.) Hence the need for places like… the library… the churches… community centers… Not all of them are the perfect fit for anyone but choice and differences are still available. Some of these people rarely “plug-in”. Actually, some are planning to go from smart-phone to flip-phone so they feel they won’t be getting constant notifications about what people are posting anymore. Quality time for themselves.

In this frightful journey of excessive peaks and valleys I discovered I am sure a whole lot smarter and wiser than I was ever given credit for. I also discovered chat rooms still exist, THANK GOD! A stream of typed discussion, even in abbreviations is un-clickable. Really gets me out of that awful habit sometimes. Some chatters apologize for their typos and I tell them, “No. It’s okay. I can speak typo! I understand what you’re saying. It’s clicks and silent numbers and memes and cartoon stickers I don’t understand. I can’t really speak meme or link. I just can’t comprehend those languages most of the time.”

I also discovered other avenues of social activity are still alive and kicking. Coronet Instructional Films may be cheesy, but “What To Do On A Date” makes a good point to this day, even in simple friendships. Claims one only uses Facebook for pictures can easily be compartmentalized in places like pinterest, instagram, or snapchat. And quieter social networks without pinging notifications are used by many, they’re just quieter is all. They don’t make noises like they are constantly ringing your doorbell.

However, Colonel Mustard in the film Clue does have this to say,

“Now there is still one thing I don’t understand.”

I suppose I’ll have to respond as Professor Plum does:

One thing?